Vocal processing

The Lounge Other Gear
21

weirdly this seems to be my area haha.

it’s not something I’ve seen much anywhere beyond the one I own but I use a Catalinbread Heliotrope that covers dirt-box, bit-crusher, ring-mod-ish tones - if you can find might be that just MAW and that gets you where you wanna go.

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I am still struggling to get a vocal sound I like. Been trying this for about a year now and it seems surprisingly hard for me. I find most online tutorials or dedicated vocal devices not helpful, since they often aim for either classic rock sound or modern pop/rnb style vocals. So any suggestions on gear/plugins and settings is much appreciated.

I’m using a Shure SM58, so pretty basic stuff.

As an example of what I really would like my vocals to sound like, I really like Kelly Lee Owens’ reverb drenched and defined, yet not too clean live vocals:

I have a rather deep voice (think Joy Division), which I suspect might be the root of my problems so far. Wondering whether I need some EQ / compressing at the beginning of my effects chain first.

Two options are available to me:

  1. Using external pedals so I have hands on control to tweak stuff and also get a warm enough signal to optionally feed vocals into OT (not a must). Have been trying combinations of a cheap tube preamp or Strymon Deco to saturate and heat up signal and then go into a reverb pedal like Specular Tempus or Empress Reverb. Mixed results so far. 70s spring reverb on Specular with around 30-40% decay and a bit of pre-delay works okay. Empress is helpful because I can control output level and have hi and lo cut, but most algos still sound too dark.
  2. Using Ableton plugins (preferably on board effects) and settle for a default setting which works around 80% of the time. Since my vocals are on a dedicated track on Ableton when using the pedals, I might as well get rid of the pedals and use the built in preamp of my Interface (Focusrite Scarlett), if I can get good results.

I know this is a bit tricky via a post here but maybe you can point me in the right directions.

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What is it that you don’t like with sound you have ? It may help us answer. That said , while the sm58 is a very good microphone it 's a dynamic one . You could consider trying another mic for voice recording . Something like the rodes nt1a as an example ( entry level mic , not too expensive ) . Also where do you record ? If your room is untreated it might affect you sound even with a good mic.

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Nice to see this pop up - in the end I’ve done nothing at all about this, but it does see coming into my head. Since I posted this I also read about Giant Swan’s setup/vocal chain:

I send a vocal chain through an octave pedal – EHX POG2 – a Behringer digital delay and two loopers – [Line 6] DL4 and Boss RC20 – all sent to a sub mixer. Control room out to the amp. We both play through an Ampeg 8x10 bass amp

There’s also this for total sonic destruction:

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Thanks for your mic suggestion, I will check it out.

I record in my living room which definitely doesn’t have the best acoustics. But I think it should still be possible to get something at least decent sounding?

It’s a bit hard to grasp what I don’t like, but if this makes any sense to you:

  1. Reverb is always too dark and a bit murky, even if using a lot of lo cut on the Empress Reverb
  2. Reverb is too intense and could be more intense at the same time. I feel like my vocals should be more present up front but then the reverb should be more intense as well. I always feel like the reverb decay or mix should be longer, but after increasing it, I feel like it then dominates without sounding good by itself. I guess better pre-delay settings could help and maybe some kind of eq or echo up front or both?
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I did some voice recording in my living room too, as long as your are not catching too much of the room acoustics (as an untreated room will enhance some unwanted frequencies), it should be ok, especially with a sm58, which is a cardioid mic.
I should first state that I am just a hobbyist, but it seems to me your issue is more about mixing your voice, right ?
So first thing, what i’d do is to mix the voice in context of the song, without any effects like delay and reverb. Start with volume. Then make sure eq and compression are ok to my ears. Then only, i’d start to add reverb to glue the voice in the context of the song, and keep it subtle, as for me the best reverb, is the one I don’t explicitly ear. ( this, of course, unless you want to use reverb as an effect that define your sound ).
Also, you will have more control over you reverb if you add it as a plugin in your daw ( I exclusively use the stock plugin in cubase, no need to buy a fancy reverb for now, unless you want a specific sound), but you also can record it directly from your pedal (100% wet, so you can dose it like you want along the song). You can also try to side chain compress the reverb bus with your voice track, so the reverb only comes up when you don’t sing, it helps to keep clarity. Hope this helps !

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Another thought could be to use an SP sampler for vocal input & fx.

404mk2 can take mic > gain > 1x input fx > 2x bus fx > 1x master > fx > output.
Though then, any sample or line in sounds played out of it go through the same bus & master fx that you’ve picked for vocals, so kind of limiting for using it for anything else at the same time.

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Ooo, that Noisy Mic-2 looks awesome!

defintely curious now about a couple of those JMT synths

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I’m setting up a… let’s say overengineered karaoke party, and I wanted to give the option for shy guests to use a vocal chain VST with mild reverb, maybe some compression to even out the performance and barely perceptible autotune.

Is there any good plugin I should consider to that end? I can try a trial or get through a service or do a one-off for the party so price is less an issue.

While I could set up a series of VSTs to mimic a traditional chain, I’d prefer to have something all-in-one so I can flick through presets or tweak all on the same page to avoid fiddling with 5 different plugins on the fly :slight_smile:

I vaguely recall something like that from Antares in the past, I’m curious if anyone’s aware of anything offhand. When I search for “Vocal chain” vst, I get mostly the individual plugins that could be chained together and not an all-in-one solution. Which yes, the quality is probably better going with accurate emulations of the hardware, but less convenient for what I’m looking for here.

Thanks!

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…for live singing, tc helicons voice live stuff is first choice…

but seems like ur more into shouting at top of ur lungs, deep growling animal like, gnarling noises and distorted reality word stutters…

for that u better have two mics to start with…one cheap and easy to overblow one running through some delay pedal…and one standard sm 58 running some multi fx pedal that offers delays, reverbs and distortions…

or have a tiny mixer with two aux sends for ur dry input mics…

but be warned… also shouting needs proper rehearsals, my friend…u can easily fukk up ur throat and vocal chords forever, if u don’t really know what ur doing while constantly barking into the great wide open…

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I’ve recently been using my Finegear Dust Collector along with an Eventide Pitchfactor for vocal processing. My set up at the moment utilizes the tape saturation effect going into the spring reverb (Both on the Dust Collector) and then Into the Pitchfactor on octave setting. I struggle to find vocal chains that work for me but I have really enjoyed this one. The tape saturation effect on the DC is pretty dynamic. It can sound totally overblown depending on the sound source and settings but my use tends to be more on the subtle side. I find it warms my vocals up and has a bit more clarity and bite. The cool thing is that if it is not effected enough you can run the first tape saturation into the second tape saturation which will compound the distorted effect. I was actually kind of on the fence about the Dust Collector the first couple of months I had it (it’s large and not cheap) but I have found great uses for all the effects. The phaser sounds great on bass and synths, the delay is dirty as all get out (probably would also make vocals pretty gnarly) and is Great for experimenting, the tape saturation is also nice for stereo drum buss duties, and the spring reverb is lush and subtle enough at lower settings.
The eventide Pitchfactor is worth the price for the Micropitch alone but I’ve also found a lot of uses for the other effects.
Like I said, the downside of t he DC is the size but it’s handy to have all those effects in one box.

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Exactly - nice vocal harmonies I am not!

That looks really cool!

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This is a good recommendation!

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On a less serious note… maybe this thread will be helpful.

https://www.modwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=60936&hilit=ministry+vocal

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I’m currently using the TC-Helicon VoiceLive Play, I should check out the Pitchfactor though, I’m really looking for something closer to it, does anyone use mics with the H90 Harmonizer?

While I would be saddened, I could probably replace my Ensoniq dp4 with it if the UI is smooth enough.

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Yeah OhGr did need to address his polyps at some point with vocal training when the body couldn’t sustain. I’ve been doing training and finally getting to screaming / overtones and that’s been super good (beyond that I am “reserved” and need to work into getting into a more feral state of mind when there’s another person in the house or it’s late at night :smiley: )

@new_drugs For the Pitchfactor, do you use the mic directly in, or in a loop post-preamp?

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How do you like the voicelive play?

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It was competent, and not over-expensive, I ended up selling it recently to a casino house band. I hear that the Voicelive Extreme is the next thing to try, but I don’t think it’ll be the sound and workflow I’m looking for.

My goal is industrial vocal processing ala the aforementioned Skinny Puppy. I know some low ms high feedback delay is essential to that, can get there with an OTO Bim but the pitch shifting… I had a BOSS SE-50 but the noise was a bit of a put-off. I can do what I want with Sound Toys and plugins but would still love a non-computer option. I ended up selling the lovely DP/4 just because Sound Toys was more accessible for me.

At this point I’m looking into a OBNE Maw (low fi algorithms but perhaps i can deal, ideally I’d try it out locally), Pitchfactor, H90.

I have fine pres and could probably run a secondary laptop with just a live vocal processing chain (tempting because I know I can get what I want.) But extra space taken up makes that less desirable.

I’m a widdle fussy baby I completely realize, and later SP/OhGr magic absolutely comes from the voice* and Mark Walk and Cevin Key’s ADHD fiddling post-take.

I wonder if there’s a signal processing algo for norns that might be useful? The ER-301 sound computer is pretty much unavailable so I don’t think there’s a comparable DSP box for me.

*Large investments in time and $ have been great for developing my own instrument, i’m not choir-grade but I’ve gotten far I feel from before taking lessons and reinforcing with practice.

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Well that reminds me I can just use the MacBook and voice plugins. I don’t use it much but it would be perfect for this!

Thanks!

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Yeah, beyond Sound Toys’ dynamics, harmonizer, and grit Melodyne can really do interesting fuckery to any vocal performance though not realtime.

Haven’t found good enough deals on Eventide’s plugins, but I’m sure they’re fine.

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